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Post by Xanatos on Feb 2, 2005 14:09:37 GMT -5
This is to go off the evolution thread. They say Darwin, before he journeyed on the H.M.S. Beagle was a firm Christian. He was the only christian on the boat. He then preceded to have his believes washed away, and published his theory, which is now one of the top enemys of the Bible. Did he go to heaven? explain your answer.
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Post by Triphus (Titanian) on Feb 2, 2005 23:26:45 GMT -5
This is an interesting topic Xanatos. I honostly have no idea and will not accuse him of anything because I have not studied him or really know anything about him other than his ideas.
All I can say is if he repented and asked Jesus into his heart before he died I believe he would be in Heaven. Though I am not one to say since Jesus is the one true Judge.
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Post by Chocolate Bar on Feb 3, 2005 12:17:53 GMT -5
I agree ith titanian
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Post by Armany on Feb 3, 2005 16:05:51 GMT -5
We did delve into this a little bit on the evoltuion thread about a month ago. Right now, I'd have to say I'm with Titanian.
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ApologeticChrist
Junior Member
Here, I hone Apologetics for the glory of Jesus Christ
Posts: 77
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Post by ApologeticChrist on Feb 8, 2005 18:28:30 GMT -5
Agreed. Even the worst sinner can come to Christ, no matter what's happened. I don't even think he was evil, he was just trying to make sense of his world. But that is just a personal opinion.
-R. S. of UC
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Post by GDL on Feb 13, 2005 21:05:28 GMT -5
I also agree with Titanian.Because I certainley can't judge anyone.Only the Father and son have the authority to do that.
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awaz
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Post by awaz on Jan 17, 2006 22:44:47 GMT -5
The only problem with all that, is the woman who claimed he did convert has been proven to have been over 500 miles away from his deathbed at the time of his death.
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Post by heartofgold on Jan 17, 2006 23:38:18 GMT -5
Well, first off, I don't know, won't know 'till I'm dead, and when I am, I'm not going to come back and tell anyone. But I do have a question (since I'm afraid I'm not incredibly familiar with the Darwin story, or his writings, though I get the gist of them). Did he in his writings say there was no God? I don't care if you believe in evolution, I think your wrong, but your entitled to believe in it. Its weather you believe there is no God. Did Darwin renounce his beliefs publicly (or did he never have them)? Because if I were Darwin and saw what he saw, I'd try and make it a scientific theory too. I'd have given it up by now I think, but I would have tried. Basically what I'm asking is, did he renounce Christianity, or did he just come up with the theory of Evolution, making us all think he's evil? Oh, and I'm not trying to take the bad guy side (again  ), I'm just curious. |
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Post by steelsheen on Jan 17, 2006 23:53:06 GMT -5
This is not for me to say. I'm not God.
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awaz
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Post by awaz on Jan 18, 2006 11:39:37 GMT -5
I'm not so sure he renounced Christianity so much as Christianity was the socially correct thing to do.
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Post by Siko Michael on Jan 18, 2006 15:36:42 GMT -5
I really dont like to say this person made it into heaven and that person didnt, since jesus recommends us not to judge others.
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Post by heartofgold on Jan 18, 2006 16:12:50 GMT -5
That's a good point.
Actually, what I've heard is he'd given it up before he got on the boat. I don't think seeing the finches or whatever he saw would have been enough for anyone to give up his faith. So I suspect it was gone before he ever even thought about evolution.
Which brings up the point, does this make him an evil man? I mean, there are a lot of atheists, and not all of them are evil to the core. I think their ignorant, but not evil. And like I said, if I'd seen the finches, I'd try to make it a theory too.
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Post by gynovia on Jan 18, 2006 18:02:26 GMT -5
hey, I'm not God so i don't really have a say. If he recieved Christ then yes, he's in heaven. if he rejected him then no. but, i guess we'll only know when we get to heaven.
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Post by falklands on Jan 18, 2006 18:27:30 GMT -5
Let me explain. Darwin, by observing the finches, disproved the belief of the "immutability of species". This was the belief that, for example, every breed of dog had been there since the beginning of creation. It never changed, no matter what. This Darwin disproved, proving his own theory of "microevolution", the ability for species to adapt to their environments. However, he thought that microevolution could go on indefinitely, producing completely different creatures. This is macroevolution, which is false.
As for his faith, it eroded during his time on the HMS Beagle. At the beginning of the voyage he often bore the brunt of a good deal of laughter "...from several of the officers for quoting the Bible as final authority on some moral point."
A few years after the voyage, however, he stated "...that the Old Testament from its manifest false history of the world, with the Tower of Babel, the rainbow as a sign, etc., etc., and from its attributing to God the feelings of a revengeful tyrant, was no more to be trusted than the sacred books of the Hindoos [sic], or the beliefs of any barbarian."
Clearly his faith had eroded into nothing since the voyage.
As for the deathbed recantation story, it is almost certainly a lie. Really.
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torc
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Post by torc on Jan 18, 2006 21:55:04 GMT -5
I am goign to keep this quick. (and yes, for this topic, this is quick)
Evolution in the terms of Darwin is NOT completely anti-Bible. We all know the bible is full of symbolism and 6 days could just be a metaphor to be used to teach the uneducated jews of 5000 years ago.
The question is what sparked life. Modern evolutionists take Darwin to the extreme and far beyond what he meant and claim that life was sparked by random combinations of nucleic acics. That, of course, would negate the idea of creationism.
However, Darwin's idea that life adapts over time (natural selection) is indesputable. It only stands to reason that changes over millions of years allow for things to slowly evolve into other things. What is important to Christians is not the process, but the start and inspiration o it.
Darwin, from what I have read, might not have sinned by publishing his On the origin of species by natural selection, but as for his spiritual condition none of us are to judge. We never judge a spiritual condition.
No matter what he did, if he was saved, he is in heaven, if not, then hell. That is all there is to it.
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Post by Siko Michael on Jan 19, 2006 11:57:31 GMT -5
this is possible but then again Darwin stole 75% of his work from his grandfather and claimed it as his own, so i guess you now know what kinda of person he was.
The obvious that everyone knows....lol
siko
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torc
Full Member
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Post by torc on Jan 19, 2006 20:10:16 GMT -5
sometimes the obvious needs restatement.
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Post by falklands on Jan 19, 2006 20:39:57 GMT -5
I am goign to keep this quick. (and yes, for this topic, this is quick) Evolution in the terms of Darwin is NOT completely anti-Bible. We all know the bible is full of symbolism and 6 days could just be a metaphor to be used to teach the uneducated jews of 5000 years ago. The hebrew word "yom" means different things in different contexts, but in contexts like Genesis 1 it means a 24-hour period 100% of the time. Besides, if it was just a metaphor, you have to assume all the ages of men described in Genesis was false (how could a precise layout of years be "metaphorical"?) I believe symbolism in the Bible only applies when there is an obvious metaphor, like Revelation. The Word of God is innerant and true. Darwinism also says we came from apes. Negating the idea that we are made in the image of God. I repeat, there is a huge difference between microevolution (things adapting over time, but not completely changing) and macroevolution (things completely changing into different things through mutations that are somehow "beneficial" every time). Need I say more? |
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awaz
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Post by awaz on Jan 19, 2006 22:31:11 GMT -5
[quote author=chickenwingmajor board=debate thread=1107371377 post=1137689851
How do you know he stole the work? Can you cite proof?
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Post by Siko Michael on Jan 20, 2006 13:47:35 GMT -5
well, my uncle joe who is a preacher watched a special on Darwin and every time i see him he says darwin stole blah and darwin di blah, blah....but i will try to find a actual cite for everyone. siko Addition: it appears that Darwin's grandfather Erasmus Darwin stated some of Charles Darwin's later theories in Darwin's The Botanic Garden, The Economy of Vegetation in 1791 such as the big bang theory in this poem: Roll on, ye Stars! exult in youthful prime,
Mark with bright curves the printless steps of Time;
Near and more near your beamy cars approach,
And lessening orbs on lessening orbs encroach; —
Flowers of the sky! ye too to age must yield,
Frail as your silken sisters of the field!
Star after star from Heaven's high arch shall rush,
Suns sink on suns, and systems systems crush,
Headlong, extinct, to one dark center fall,
And Death and Night and Chaos mingle all!
— Till o'er the wreck, emerging from the storm,
Immortal Nature lifts her changeful form,
Mounts from her funeral pyre on wings of flame,
And soars and shines, another and the same.source en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erasmus_Darwin |
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Post by volcanicmac on Mar 9, 2006 19:48:59 GMT -5
Darwin is not in Heaven, because no one is in Heaven right now except for God, the Angels, and Moses, Elijah, and Enoch.
People do not go to heaven or hell when they die. They lay sleeping. The Bible CLEARLY states this fact.
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Post by Geberia on Mar 10, 2006 15:36:47 GMT -5
Umm, well yes, our bodies are said to be sleeping, but whether or not you think that they are now, the important fact is that one day we WILL be in heaven ( we being those of us who have accepted Jesus Christ as our LORD and Saviour.) And yes, if we die unsaved we go to hell. Look at the parable Jesus told of the rich man and Lazarus the beggar. The rich man went straight to hell.
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Post by volcanicmac on Mar 11, 2006 0:27:56 GMT -5
No, our body, our minds and our souls lay sleeping when we are dead. "The Dead No Nothing." Darwin is NOT in Heaven. After dying, we do not go anywhere. Read the Bible more closely |
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Post by Triphus (Titanian) on Mar 20, 2006 10:32:12 GMT -5
Um where do you find this in the Bible volcanicmac?
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Post by christian on Mar 20, 2006 13:50:46 GMT -5
from what i understand people are born sinful and evil thats why we come to christ to have the evil and sin washed away and replaced with the holy spirit
in that time period there was alot of people faking to be christians tho
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), I'm just curious.
